Opinion | Staff Editorials

Vote yes

As the official voice of the Spectator, the Editorial Board offers its opinions on issues relevant to Columbia.

As Columbia students, we tend to extend our philosophical outlook to all issues on campus. Simple chats wind up being rants about imperialism, Valentine’s Day an argument over gender identity, and Manhattanville a case study of gentrification.

Therefore, we shouldn’t be surprised that ideology has rested at the heart of the debate over Columbia’s relationship with the military. But this is one discussion that should not be rooted only in intellectual justification.

The strictly ideological approach to the return of ROTC has proven unproductive and short sighted. By framing the debate over ROTC’s return to Columbia in rigidly philosophical terms, we overlook more important arguments. In addition to an analysis based on ethical maxims, a realistic evaluation of the costs and benefits of military involvement proves that ROTC should be invited back to Columbia.

Whether or not they choose to enroll in ROTC, Columbia students stand to benefit from its return. Just as a need-blind financial aid policy has opened Columbia up to many students, ROTC would make Columbia accessible to an underrepresented part of America’s population. Many students who join ROTC are prompted by financial concerns, indicating that ROTC could increase economic diversity on campus—a major criticism leveled against Columbia that has proven difficult to combat. Students who seek ROTC membership would also increase the diversity of outlook and experience in a sometimes homogeneous student body.

We agree with our ideologically unyielding peers who point out that the military has flawed policies. Women experience unacceptably high levels of sexual violence and abuse, and the repeal of DADT will not end discrimination against transgender individuals. We strongly oppose these remnants of military discrimination—but propose a different way of dealing with them.

Student groups who oppose the return of ROTC have taken an approach of passive resistance through non-participation in military programs. But is this the most effective way to agitate for change? Instead, by engaging the military through ROTC programs, open-minded Columbia students could reform the system from within. If we remain isolated from the military, we will have no influence over their policies. Engagement—not self-imposed segregation—is the way to reform. The military is not a company that we can boycott or a country from which we can divest—it is a vital part of our nation’s identity that cannot be ignored.

This type of uncompromising opposition also breeds misinformation. Few students know—because non-engagement makes this information nonessential—that ROTC has never been banned at Columbia. Instead, the administration pursued a de facto ban, putting limits on military participation that made operating a program here impossible. These facts, among many others, are critical for students who are voting in the online poll to know.

Our hope is that engagement with the military will create a more open, tolerant military culture that will mobilize to reverse remaining discriminatory policies. We assume that Columbia students, due to their open-mindedness and tolerance towards people with different views and lifestyles, will acquire leadership positions in the military that will allow them to implement such changes. These reforms won’t be immediate, but ROTC is the best chance we have to make the military an institution more in accordance with our principles of equality. Our academic experience at Columbia that instills us with values of honesty, justice, mercy, and truth can be practically applied in military service.

To deny students who seek ROTC membership the chance to pursue military service, regardless of their reasons, is itself ideologically flawed.

So Columbia students, we urge you to peek your heads out of our ivory tower and consider what ROTC has to offer. Vote yes to ROTC.

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Anonymous posted on

Disgraceful the hissing and booing of freshman, Anthony Maschek: not the way you greeted with cheers and applause the dangerous president of the Islamic Republic of Iran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. Wake up Columbia! I'm ashamed and sick and tired of having to make excuses for my alma mater.

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Anonymous posted on

three students booed the vet... it would have happened at any school, in any town in the country. There are always going to be a few radicals and certainly the majority of students condemn tht incident.. geez!

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Anonymous posted on

THANK you. Honestly I'm sick of people who had absolutely no idea what happened feeling like they need to weigh in on this.

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Anonymous posted on

Lame justification. It wouldn't have happened at ANY school or ANY town.

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jamesw62 posted on

that is THREE TOO MANY, dont you think?

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Anonymous posted on

Usually when I think of "town hall" this past year, I think of ridiculous, abhorrent displays of civility by "real amuricans," so don't you come in here on our campus and tell us what to do. If there's anything that CU students hate more than the angry left, its the angry right. Go ahead, keep posting--Sammy Roth just had an interview with the pro-ROTC side at Brad's where they said they were extremely concerned about the attention this was getting, and it could very well turn the tide against their cause. Go ahead, get Sarah Palin to tweet something about it. I dare you.

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Anonymous posted on

no, it wouldn't have happened at any school, in any town in the country. it most likely would've happened at any other school, in any town on the east coast. there are other universities that actually have respect for our veterans, it's unfortunate that most of them are in the south and west.

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Anonymous posted on

What three people booed and jeered Ahmadinejad?

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Anonymous posted on

If you really believe that a wounded vet in a wheelchair would have been booed at any school in any town in America, then you know nothing about America. Your unexamined parochial prejudice is the best reason why Columbia needs to invite outside perspectives into its claustrophobic ideological coccoon.

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Anonymous posted on

The spoiled pea-brains who are warped enough to heckle and boo an disabled war veteran can be mighty proud of themselves. These people are no different than the Westboro church lunatics protesting at KIA funerals. Great work you sick fucks.

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Anonymous posted on

While I agree that DADT is a nonsensical policy and should have been revoked years ago, the stated opinion addressing sexual assault problems and the Militaries policy on such issues is ill informed at best. The National Institute for Justice published a study on sexual assaults on college campuses http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1.... And what they found as a result of data collection was shocking. The truth is that most sexual assault cases on college campuses go unreported, whereas the Military is more self-disclosing on the problem. Columbia University , for some reason acts as though, the military and its members are made up of people who are different than all other Americans, when in fact the military itself is nothing more than a sampling of our society nearly mirroring the rest of the population in most ways. I saw on one posting where protestors held up signs stating that the military targets the poor in recruiting new members. The Military provides people with an opportunity at education that is far superior to most state governments and leaps and bounds above those of prestigious learning institutions such as Columbia, Harvard, or Yale. Show me a student with a 900 SAT score and a 2.0 GPA attending Columbia and I’ll show you a Senators kid. Columbia and many of the other ultra-liberal learning institutions live in a bubble more so than most. Thinking that they are capable of changing a culture by their mere presence is typical of their arrogant elitist mentality.

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Anonymous posted on

Columbia has been ranked the top Journalism School in the nation and their students are highly recruited by the liberal, freedom-phobic, lame stream media. Too bad these ivy-league students dont realize that their freedoms, like Freedom of the Press, are protected by the miltary defenders (Anthony Maschek) they mock.

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Anonymous posted on

I see the Tea Party has decided to weigh in, what with it's witty catch-phrases like "lame stream media". Those are almost as good as the radical left's "Amerikkka"! YOU GUYS ARE SO CLEVER.

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Anonymous posted on

hahaha thank you

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jamesw62 posted on

and you know this person is a tea party member....... how?
fact is you dont. the media in america has been so one sided for years

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Tom @ The Rolltop Manifesto posted on

Retired Soldier JC stole some of my thunder, but I'll comment anyway. While I applaud the Spectator's position, it's rationale - essentially "let's change the military by allowing them to bask in our presence on campus" - does reflects the bubble perspective that Retired Soldier mentions. It also hints at a desire - perhaps not entirely genuine, but that's ok - to engage. It's an acknowledgment that a more mature and reasoned approach is needed, so suds to them for that.

But I would counter the Spectator's view by suggesting that change to the military will not come from a presence on campus, but from the campus presence in it. Our military ought to be truly representative of the society it exists to defend. The young woman at the Maschek speech with the sign accusing the military of targeting the underprivileged was right, but for the wrong reason. Ours is a military of volunteers. Young people have to be sold on the idea (and ideal) of military service. With limited recruiting dollars, the armed forces go where they can to recruit those who would join them. A truly egalitarian approach certain to address that young woman's concern would be to reinstate the draft with none of the higher education or national guard dodges that rightfully earned scorn during Vietnam. Any takers?

While not a fix to all that separates our society's elites from those that defend it, an ROTC presence on campus would be a small but important step towards integration by presenting a daily reminder of the reality of military service as a vocation and the opportunity to pursue it. How many Columbia grads are on active service right now? How about Harvard? Yale? Stanford? I think we can safely assume those institutions are woefully underrepresented. Change to the military - whatever change you seek - will come from within. While the military's traditions and point of view can to some extent be traced to its mission, much of its culture and outlook are brought to it by those who serve. Want to change the military? Infiltrate it.

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Anonymous posted on

Tom hit on the most important aspect of the discussion, change from within. I had a young soldier in my unit a few years back, who I regarded as a benchmark soldier. Competent, highly intelligent, motivated and a standard bearer for Army values and loyalty, I would have loved to have held onto him as a career soldier. This soldier, I am proud to say, is now a student at Columbia University. I read his posts on Face Book as well as some commentaries he has submitted to news publications and I am very proud that he has held onto the values and beliefs that he lived by while serving his country.
In response to MAX’s comment, “do you know how the military works?” After 20+ years of service I do. A command climate dictates it policies and prioritizes the importance of each. Leadership is difficult and challenges a person’s ability to make sound, timely and educated decisions at all levels. Truly successful commands are measured not in body counts or battle damage assessments, but in the number of lives saved, positively stabilized communities and the capacity to maintain those assets over the long haul.
As a Senior Enlisted Advisor to several Commanders, I had the privilege to serve under a variety of Commanders with a broad spectrum of leadership styles as well as educational backgrounds to include a Flight Surgeon who graduated from Berkley and a Chemical officer who was a University of San Francisco Alumni. These officers along with many others were able to work harmoniously with West Pointers and VMI graduates often creating the most effective and successful units. In addition these leaders provided a different perspective and work atmosphere for their soldiers which proved to be a catalyst for the effectiveness and morale of the unit.
Our government chooses the use of the Military to solve problems and stabilize threats globally. Although I don’t always agree with the use of our soldiers I support the men and women who volunteer to do so. The attitude that ROTC is incompatible with Columbia University is narrow minded. Some of the most creative, open minded and forethoughtful people I have ever met were in the Military. Although the military is a tool used by the government, it is the property of the people of the United States. The military is constantly trying to improve itself and invent better ways of accomplishing its mission. I would think that a learning institution as prestigious as Columbia would want to participate in the Improvement process. I almost feel as though, some of the commentary I have read on this topic is based on self-Image of the school and ill-informed pop culture….it disturbs me.

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Anonymous posted on

Dear Columbia,

Don't bother, the military is better off without your close-minded alums. As a former office and ROTC alum, I can attest that we need free-thinkers who can solve complex problems under intense stress, not small-minded smart-alecks whose first thought is "what's in it for me?".

We've gone several decades without you, so believe me when we say that we don't miss you. You're a much better fit for Wall Street in any case.

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Tom @ The Rolltop Manifesto posted on

As a former officer and ROTC alum, I don't find the military to be any more open minded, but I take your point. I think when university elitists point the finger at military close-mindedness, it's often a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

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Anonymous posted on

"the pot calling the kettle black"

I don't know what this means but I find it offensive.

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Anonymous posted on

How can you find something you don't understand "offensive"? God help us if this is the next greatest gerenation.

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Anonymous posted on

"Instead, by engaging the military through ROTC programs, open-minded Columbia students could reform the system from within."

Good luck with that. Do you know anything about how the military works?

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Sean posted on

Yes we do. Some of us are in the military.

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Anonymous posted on

... Or were in the military. For those of us who were enlisted soldiers especially, the idea of powerless commissioned officers does not compute.

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Anonymous posted on

Ok, Columbia. Then be consistent. Ban all groups with flawed policies. Perspective must be considered. Misogynist fraternities, radical greens, communist leftists.

All bureaucracies are flawed, including your esteemed institution. Lurching into communism will not solve the problem.

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Anonymous posted on

Thanks to the students in ROTC and the Vets at CU for your service. It was bad enough reading about what happened before I found out that the Vet being heckled lost a leg, but after realizing it, I'm just speechless.

To current CU students: Please vote on the ROTC question, so we can show the country that these degenerates are a small minority (hopefully), even though the Board of Trustees has allowed CU to be run by a self-declared Constitutional “scholar” who was told he is wrong not just by Scalia and Thomas, but by the former ACLU lawyer, CU student and professor, Justice Ginsburg, in a case where this “scholar” claimed that CU had a constitutional right to both take government money AND thumb its nose at the military. Then this cowardly “scholar” hid behind the University Senate to continue to deny ROTC a place at CU.

But I digress, now that the “scholar” has gotten what he demanded in the repeal of DADT. Why is this “scholar” still hiding behind others instead of being a leader and coming out to say “welcome ROTC?” I haven’t read all the stories about this incident yet, but has this “scholar” said anything of value yet, or is he still hiding because he’s afraid of what his fellow travelers will say to him?

I’ll just keep sending my CU money to the heroes at ROTC instead of to CU to use for an ever bigger administration and bigger salaries to the leaders.

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Anonymous posted on

"Degenerates"? Should we be sent to camps, too?

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Anonymous posted on

CC11: Did you just call yourself a degenerate? In answer to your question, as someone whose family was sent to camps in the 1940s and 1950s by an evil left wing dictatorship that invaded their country - a country that didn't have an army to defend itself - let me ponder for a second if I would want you to have everything taken away from you and have you sent to a camp for a while for reeducation.... OK. I decided. I'd rather live in a place where even degenerates are free to run about, than in a place where the leaders can decide who the enemy of the people are, and send them off. Unlike you, I'd like to have an army to defend me and my family from people who want to do evil things to us - the people that the CU vet referred to when you and your fellow degenerates started booing.

PS: if you're trying to figure out which evil dictatorship I'm referring to, it's the one that you and your fellow travelers would have been supporting if you had come of age between 1917 and 1989. Your older fellow travelers went quiet for a few years after 1989/1991, but unfortunately, they’ve crept up their heads again.

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Anonymous posted on

Did I say EN'95? I meant EN'94. My Bad.

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Anonymous posted on

Why are people who do not attend this school continuing to comment? Go away. This is our issue.

Your spelling mistakes annoy me.

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Anonymous posted on

WORD.

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Anonymous posted on

This became a national issue when a small handful of students decided to heckle a seriously wounded veteran, thus inviting national news coverage on their disgraceful behavior. Columbia has to decide the issue, but we've invited this outside attention on ourselves.

Some of these non-Columbia folks posting are soldiers and former soldiers. I would think that we would value their perspective, uncommon as it is here on campus. I know I value it.

On the other hand, the anti-ROTC folks have been busy tearing down pro-ROTC signs in Hamilton and perhaps elsewhere as well, so maybe what you mean when you say "this is our issue" is "this is my issue and I'm not interested in having an open discussion about it."

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Anonymous posted on

PS, on actually checking into this, I don't actually believe that anyone tore down the pro-ROTC posters. They were probably just torn down in the weekly cleaning of the bulletin boards, and the anti-ROTC groups were just very fast about getting their posters back up. I based this accusation on the fact that someone claimed to have seen groups tearing down pro-ROTC posters at the same time as they were putting up anti-ROTC posters. But I don't know the person who said that, and I don't have any evidence to verify it for myself, and the fact is I don't believe it. So I apologize for making that claim and I retract it.

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jamesw62 posted on

its called freedom of speech.
yes its a problem on campus, but when it makes national news, then of course your going to get people from all over. you cant stop that

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Anonymous posted on

I can decide all on my own which issues are mine and which are not. I will comment on what I want, when I want and how I want. It’s called the first amendment and I’m pretty sure I’ve earned the right to utilize it…have you?

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Anonymous posted on

Correction was your issue until a few of your "fellow students" decided to show their asses to the world by virtue of opening their mouths. You see one thing that the military DOES teach is teamwork and comraderie and what "one does affects us all". Too bad those of you seeking a higher education are so foolish as to not realize a basic tenet of humankind courtesy, respect, and comraderie, good or bad. Maybe if it is "our" issue as you so vehemently point out, the student body could do a far better job at policing the "mouths" of some of the deplorable excuses of human filth that occupy your campus and try to speak for your school when their comments are neither wanted nor appreciated on the world stage.

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Anonymous posted on

Maybe all of you people who don't go here could actually read what's being written besides these biased articles. If you took the time to read the comments and other articles written (many in the spectator today) you would find well-thought out arguments, both for and against ROTC, and many people who are as disgusted as all of you as to what members of our community did.

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Anonymous posted on

Undergraduate - There are no spelling mistakes in my email and fyi, "my alma mater" means that I paid my four years of tuition to Columbia and feel obligated/entitled to weigh in on the liberal, anti-military, anti-American sentiment still prevalent on campus.

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Anonymous posted on

You've made it our issue, punk. Your narrow-minded rejection of American values and your tortoise like aversion of the outside world compels our intervention. Sooner or later, you will need to face the greater world which does not subscribe to your radical infantile prejudices. You can not hide at Columbia forever. If Columbia has not prepared you to defend yourself intellectually, then perhaps all this elitist talk is so much empty boasting.

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Anonymous posted on

I applaud the Spectator for tackling this issue as honestly as their young lives and experience permits. I have great respect for our military and thank them for their willingness to go to the corners of the world even when we don't agree. What would it take for some people feel appreciation? A bomb or bio-germ released in New York? If you're not willing protect what you have from those who wish to destroy you/all of us, don't find fault with those who do. We know the military is not perfect, but the next time there's a disaster will you be the first on the job??

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Anonymous posted on

Thanks to GI Bill benefits I received for my military service, I was able to attend Columbia and graduate. Thank you for your support of ROTC. Unfortunately, your attitude of "let's welcome ROTC so we can show those dumb rednecks how to live as virtuously as we do" is the sort of attitude that gets America in trouble around the world and wastes the lives of so many brave young men and women. By the way, no one has mentioned race relations. Take an honest look at life around your campus and in your classrooms and dormitories, and then take a look at life in the military. Ask yourselves which institution, Columbia or the US military has better race relations.

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Anonymous posted on

Well put James.

It was a little easier when everyone was green wasn't it?

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jack31961 posted on

The mission of any American University, cannot suceed, without the support of the military.. That is a plain fact you may accept, or hide from

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Anonymous posted on

Yeah you guys. This editorial was maybe a tad too patronizing. But the majority of these commentators need to screw off. So two or three overzealous hippies decide to boo a veteran. I can assure you that they was not representative of the CU community as a whole, anymore than soldiers taking pictures of themselves next to naked prisoners are representative of the US military. CU might be elitist, but it sure doesn't harbor a damn pack mentality.

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Anonymous posted on

I actually had no problem with the protestors, they have the right to protest…as misguided and ill-informed as they may be, they still have rights. I thought the discussion was more geared toward the ROTC question. Lively banter and colorful rhetoric are just a few things that make America great I would hope an educated man or woman would appreciate that.

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Anonymous posted on

I can assure you that they was not representative of the CU community as a whole, anymore than soldiers taking pictures of themselves next to naked prisoners are representative of the US military.

I agree to bad that the few can spoil the whole bushel so to speak so CU learns what the military had to learn, that when all the worlds a stage you might want to maintain some "decorum" amongst those acting upon it. Seems CU and the military might have a lot more in common that what most are willing to concede.

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Anonymous posted on

The difference is that the military prosecuted and punished the soldiers who improperly treated prisoners while Columbia supporters like you make excuses for the hecklers and Columbia itself is indifferent to such indecent abuse. It's a difference in values, in which Columbia's values are clearly inferior to the militarys.

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Anonymous posted on

WE ARE NOT ISOLATED FROM THE MILITARY... ROTC cadets are welcome on this campus. ROTC DOES NOT HAVE MONEY TO COME ON THIS CAMPUS! We may actually be jeopardizing the strength of regional ROTC programs by bringing it to Columbia. So the questions we should really be asking are, WHY is this being pushed? What is really in it for Bollinger/ the military?

Also, THERE IS NO EVIDENCE TO SUBSTANTIATE THE ARGUMENT THAT HAVING ROTC ON CAMPUS WILL IMPROVE MILITARY LEADERSHIP AND MOTIVATE THE MILITARY TO CHANGE ITS DISCRIMINATORY POLICY!!!!!!! (i.e. DADT was repealed without ROTC coming here!)

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Anonymous posted on

No one is talking about forcing the military to come here. We are just talking about extending an invitation. If they don't want to spend the money, that is up to them.

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Anonymous posted on

The military is not nearly so discriminatory as Columbia, which supports such student groups as the Muslim Student Association, which supports the Muslim doctrine that homosexuals be executed. The military opposes that, unlike Columbia.

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Anonymous posted on

"Diane H. Mazur, a law professor at the University of Florida and a former Air Force officer, said she doubted whether the military would reinstate the R.O.T.C. at Ivy League colleges because it is expensive to operate there, particularly for the relatively few number of students the services are likely to recruit.

“I think the military is much more persuaded by output, is much more persuaded by economic efficiency,” Ms. Mazur said."

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12...

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Anonymous posted on

This may well be completely accurate, but to my knowledge no one is talking about forcing the military to bring a ROTC program here. We are talking about extending an invitation.

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Anonymous posted on

Actually, ROTC is poorly represented in the NE region, NYC generally, and Manhattan specifically. Both SecDef Gates and JCS Mullen have acknowledged the problem in relatively recent statements at Duke, Harvard, and Columbia. I believe President Obama has mentioned the problem as well.

Army Captain Sean Wilkes CC 06 studied the ROTC in NYC issue in depth and posted his conclusions here: http://www.securenation.org/ro...

Some excerpts:

• New York City has a population of over 8 million people. There are over 605,000 college and graduate students going to school in New York City, the largest university student population of any city in the United States. Yet the city boasts a mere 30 to 40 ROTC graduates each year.

• New York “is the nation’s largest importer of college students.” That is, of students who leave their home state to attend college, more leave for New York than any other place in the country.

• With over 8 million residents, New York City has a greater population than either the state of Virginia or North Carolina. While both Virginia and North Carolina maintain twelve Army ROTC programs each, however, New York City hosts only two, both of which are granted the same resources and personnel as every other ROTC program in the country despite the enormous differences in population for which they are responsible.

Map of ROTC programs in New York City (green, blue, and white) and their proximity to other colleges and universities.
• Both ROTC Programs are located a significant distance away from the areas most concentrated in colleges and universities and are not easily accessible via subway, a fact that can be problematic given that the vast majority of students in the city do not own cars.

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Anonymous posted on

http://www.securenation.org/bl...

Few causes are as manifestly impactful as advocating for Columbia ROTC. As it is today, much of the weight of future missions will be borne by young officers. They must be able to lead their soldiers in any combination of homeland defense, disaster relief, crisis stabilization, ministerial training, conflict prevention, security and stability, counterinsurgency, counterterrorism, essential government services, emergency infrastructure, and humanitarian aid. In the short term, young lieutenants and captains prepared by Columbia ROTC will be better equipped to rapidly innovate and adapt to unpredictable challenges. Over their careers, a strong academic foundation will help Columbia officers to master their duties with a commensurately greater acquisition of faculties. Pentagon budget cuts that may lead to leaner capabilities on the ground and the forecast of politically sensitive missions that rely on smaller numbers of forces further point to a heightened need for the exceptional individual officers that Columbia can provide the nation.

The challenges facing America are great, but so are the opportunities. At this crossroads in our history, Columbia must choose: are we an “Ivory Tower” disconnected from the needs of People and nation, and only good for insular thinking and selfish pursuits? Or, are we truly America’s producer of vanguard leaders who pursue the greater good and the improvement of all parts of our society, including the military?

The challenge of our time demands the best leaders from our generation. As Dr. Martin Luther King said in another time of pressing need in American history:

"Let us stand with a greater determination. And let us move on in these powerful days, these days of challenge, to make America what it ought to be. We have an opportunity to make America a better nation."

As Columbians and Americans, it is again time for us to stand with a greater determination, for the sake of People and nation. The decision we make for ROTC at Columbia is about more than just ROTC. We are shaping our generation’s vision of Columbia University and of ourselves as fellow citizens.

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Anonymous posted on

The best people are already in the US military. If you think Columbia is the big leagues, you haven't seen much of the world and don't know much about the military, which sets a standard in excellence that few professions can match. Certainly not Columbia.

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Anonymous posted on

I'm an Army veteran as well as a Columbia graduate..

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Anonymous posted on

stevegregg take your condescending douchebaggery elsewhere. Honestly are you actually from the military or are you a 15 year old troll. You have NO idea what Columbia is like. You also have no rational argument and are basing everything on the very limited vision you have of this great American universities' interaction with the military from sensationalized news pieces.

Some immature and babied kids laughed during the speech of a veteran because they couldn't contain all their pent up emotions during a big hearing when something they disagree with was voiced. It was horrible that they did this to a veteran but seriously, even he defends their right to, and says understands them. He risked his life for it and almost paid the ultimate sacrifice.

But you can't actually believe an inappropriate yet human response is representative of any overall sentiment or attitude of the Columbia student body.

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Anonymous posted on

This editorial is disingenuous in calling the opposition to ROTC ideological. It's simply low bigotry. There is a hatred for the military at Columbia that is the product of prejudice based on ignorance.

You're also kidding yourself if you think that Columbia's "values of honesty, justice, mercy, and truth can be practically applied in military service." In these dimensions, Columbia is far inferior to the US military, as is shown by the dishonest and unjust manner in which this ban took place and the arguments made for it. In your editorial you deny any formal ban, yet you admit a de facto ban. How honest is that argument? How merciful was your treatment of that wounded vet? Kids, you have far more to learn from the US military than you have to teach it.

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Anonymous posted on

refer to above post. You have no idea what you are talking about. You sound ignorant at best.

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Anonymous posted on

Thank you for your excellent contribution to this thread. If you choose to pick up another university degree, I hope you join us at Columbia. Since one of your soldiers is here, you already know, but I'll say it anyway: we have a vibrant veterans community here at Columbia. You're welcome to join it.

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Anonymous posted on

unless of course, you were dishonorably discharged. because such a title takes away from the fact that they served at all.

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Anonymous posted on

A Naval ROTC Unit was on campus for more than 20 years. During that time no member of the Navy unit was even accused of assault on anyone. However, on at least one occasion, a young Barnard lady was saved from unwelcome attention by neighborhood bullies in front of the old West End. NROTC cadets were subjected to psychological examinations which, while no perfect, produced a student better-balanced than the average bear. If all students had to pass such an exam, we would have a better college than we do now, in my opinion.

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Anonymous posted on

"not" perfect.

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Anonymous posted on

Regarding to this piece published by the representative institute of journalism at the Columbia University, I personally find it very appallingly and disapointing. I am not a Columbia student but I like to express my concern for the underlying argument of poverty and elitism brought up by the issue of ROTC at Columbia. For us ousiders, the discussions show the perspective of the Columbia elite students in terms of the issues of war, military, and your consideration about ways in which social mobilizations can be imagined in this country.

The statement made in this piece assues (correct me if I am wrong) as if welcoming lower class young Americans who commit their lives to military servives for paying the high tuition fee in a elite univeristy means a progressive way of bringing diversity to the campus. No matter how injustice and idosyncratic when the rich kids still remain the rich ones in campus and the poor ones have to sell themselves in order to squeeze into this environment of "diversity."

Not to mention that the presence of military is never a hidden thing, and the intentifying problems of American poverty is never solved by expaned militarism either (historically and universally). The simplified equation of military and social justice expressed in this editorial piece only presents the ridicuosity of the fake claim of diversity: it wears the liberal's mask but actually is irresponsible for the real problem of inequality. Ya, bring the military along, let the poor kids go to the war. Now they can go to Ivy League universities so what are they still complaining about? Is this really the paradise for the young American poor? I find this kind of argument horribly scary.

If the current upper-class eite youth of this country, a.k.a. an institute like the editorial board of the Columbia Spectator, can so easily, and even dismissively, attribute the solution of Americam poverty and social mobilization to the military, I wonder if one still can keep their hopes for this country's intellectuals in a Ivy League institute.

As a member of the bigger community of NYC, It is indeed very disappointing to find this incrediblly superficial argument made by the student head of the Columbia journalism. It reveals the editorial board's ungrounded social-econimic perspectives, deeply.

Please show the NYC what you have learned about society in class.

And, sadly, It also forecloses more progrssive discussions that can be brought up in terms of the problem of poverty in this country. Is it what a good journalism aim for?

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